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In recent times, the most common question about WN8 has been the difference of its values in the XVM and on the third-party sites. We repeatedly answered that questions and decided that it would be better to collect key information about the problem in one message.

 

One important thing you need to know before we start: We(XVM Team) are not developers of the WN8 rating and we have nothing to do with them.

 

Why WN8 in XVM is different from those on some third-party websites?

XVM uses table of expected values v.29.1. It's the latest available correct table. Some other websites uses table v.30, which is incorrect. It can't even be called WN8.

 

Why table v.30 is incorrect?

WN8 is not static formula. It also uses a table of expected values which must be collected and updated in strict accordance with the methodology which was created by WN8 developers.

Unfortunately, formula developers no longer support their expected value table.
However, there are some enthusiasts who decided to fill the table manually, but not in accordance with the methodology by WN8 developers. I.e. instead of filling the table on the basis of real statistics, they adding values "by hand", mostly copying them from other tanks.
In fact, the rating calculated on the basis of the v.30 table can not be called WN8, because the fundamental bases of the calculation are violated.

 
What will be with WN8 in future?
At this moment there is no answer. WN8 is dying. The values which some sites shows under "WN8" name in fact is not WN8 at all.

If in the near future no one is going to collect the correct values for WN8, it can be excluded from the XVM.
Of course, we considered collecting expected values on our side. This could solve both the problem of correctness and a rare update of the table (and therefore sharp gap in the rating with every update), but with a detailed investigation of the WN8's developers method we found out out that collecting of values cannot be fully automated and requires manual control, which is inadmissible in our case.

 

I'm used WN8 for a long time. Which rating should I look at now?
In addition to WGR, EFF, WN6 also pay attention to the xTE rating.
But as well as before, we do not recommend a certain rating, but leave this choice for you.
The current WN8 values in the XVM are also still correct for the absolute majority of players, but do not take into account the results on some new vehicles.
We're also looking for a ratings which are not suffering from the disadvantages of WN8, and we can consider adding them to the mod.

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You want dem to use xTE as a global rating, paying attention dat xTE is a current tank efficiency rating, or not ? How it can be global as a WN8 etc ?

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time to added WN9 in action?

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can't new tanks be added to v29?

it can't be that hard.

 

or as a compromise, can we, users, select a source for the wn8...json?

 

thanks

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can't new tanks be added to v29?

it can't be that hard.

 

It is actually hard.  You have to gather all the stats from the servers.  This alone is a huge amount of data.  Once you have raw data you need to use R to do the necessary analysis on the data, this takes skilled data/analytics people.  Then the data has to be vetted, once all that is done, you can post the update.

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I found it funny, all websites adapted v.30, most players are OK with it, but XVM team decides otherwise. WN8 developers gave all reasoning behind the new table. Don't you think that you should follow users opinion???

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(изменено)
Why table v.30 is incorrect?

WN8 is not static formula. It also uses a table of expected values which must be collected and updated in strict accordance with the methodology which was created by WN8 developers.

Unfortunately, formula developers no longer support their expected value table.

However, there are some enthusiasts who decided to fill the table manually, but not in accordance with the methodology by WN8 developers. I.e. instead of filling the table on the basis of real statistics, they adding values "by hand", mostly copying them from other tanks.

In fact, the rating calculated on the basis of the v.30 table can not be called WN8, because the fundamental bases of the calculation are violated.

Изменено пользователем sirmax
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Same people who developed Wn8, released v30. Accordingly, who is judging that some rules are violated? XVM team?

 

You should follow users demand, not to create own assumptions. Customer is always right!!!!

 

Here is all related developers discussion, please point out your (XVM team) suggestions and comments:

http://forum.wotlabs.net/index.php?/topic/26899-wn8-change-to-averaged-expected-values/&page=2

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Same people who developed Wn8, released v30. Accordingly, who is judging that some rules are violated? XVM team?

 

You should follow users demand, not to create own assumptions. Customer is always right!!!!

 

Here is all related developers discussion, please point out your (XVM team) suggestions and comments:

http://forum.wotlabs.net/index.php?/topic/26899-wn8-change-to-averaged-expected-values/&page=2

Even if wn8 creators issues v30, it doesn't mean the table is clearly right .

XVM team decided by itself which table to use not paying attention to people's demand, coz not everyone knows all shits about these ratings, not quite everyone, you know .

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Even if wn8 creators issues v30, it doesn't mean the table is clearly right .

XVM team decided by itself which table to use not paying attention to people's demand, coz not everyone knows all shits about these ratings, not quite everyone, you know .

 

OK, but it seems the issue comes from XVM team only. As I mentioned, all other stats websites adopted v30. Players do not care about tables, but we do want to have all vehicles added and stats updated. There wont be a solution if XVM keeps waiting and, literally, doing nothing.

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OK, but it seems the issue comes from XVM team only. As I mentioned, all other stats websites adopted v30. Players do not care about tables, but we do want to have all vehicles added and stats updated. There wont be a solution if XVM keeps waiting and, literally, doing nothing.

Even Me can adapt tables, randomly including there some values for new vehicles (as someone have done already), but XVM team does not do it .

F. e. eff, xTE etc are not fully adapted, coz SPG's debuff doesn't take a part in any formula, you know, and I, time to time playing GW E, have orange xTE 26, when my dmg and frags are some less then before rebalance (damage reduced, so...), but debuff count is more than 1500-2000 from battle to battle and it counts nowhere .

So not only WN has troubles .

 

In add, when I said "issue" I meant "release" .

Sorry if disappointed you .

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In recent times, the most common question about WN8 has been the difference of its values in the XVM and on the third-party sites. We repeatedly answered that questions and decided that it would be better to collect key information about the problem in one message.

One important thing you need to know before we start: We(XVM Team) are not developers of the WN8 rating and we have nothing to do with them.

Why WN8 in XVM is different from those on some third-party websites?

XVM uses table of expected values v.29.1. It's the latest available correct table. Some other websites uses table v.30, which is incorrect. It can't even be called WN8.

All right. You don’t want to update wn8 to the new „incorrect“ Values cause you deny it? Do you think the v.29.1 is correct with the new changed SPG mechanics?

For many Players is WN8 and the new WN8, WN8… Sound strange.

Look. If you give them Pudding and everyone eats it… is good, but if you give them shit and it wobbles… they will eat it too. Because it looks like a god damn pudding! And it’s GOOOD for many Players Health.

 

Why table v.30 is incorrect?

I know! I know! For Every Tier and type same values. 100 Points!

Since the SPG new Stun mechanic… all SPG values are incorrect. v.29.1 too… Less damage… bad stats. LOL. So why complaining about v.30?

It better reroll all stats back to v.28…. oh w8… the SPG changes…. DAMMIT!

 

WN8 is not static formula. It also uses a table of expected values which must be collected and updated in strict accordance with the methodology which was created by WN8 developers.

But they gave up… I’m so sad  Really… ( you see there’s no /kappa at the end of the 3 dots) /Kappa

 

Unfortunately, formula developers no longer support their expected value table.

Unfortunately, they are just running out of Money.

 

However, there are some enthusiasts who decided to fill the table manually, but not in accordance with the methodology by WN8 developers. I.e. instead of filling the table on the basis of real statistics, they adding values "by hand", mostly copying them from other tanks.

Pudding = Shit = Pudding. Just give them what they want! Just update your Database with this Shit v.30 stats.

 

In fact, the rating calculated on the basis of the v.30 table can not be called WN8, because the fundamental bases of the calculation are violated.

Once again…. Pudding is Pudding. No one gives a shit if the v.30 is incorrect. Statswhores need Pudding! Give them shit… and they accept it. Why so selfish?

 

What will be with WN8 in future?

Let’s clarify it again, after the SPG mechanics you can carry WN8 to the Grave. And not only WN8 Ratings.

 

At this moment there is no answer. WN8 is dying. The values which some sites shows under "WN8" name in fact is not WN8 at all.

WN8 died with SPG stun mechanics and maybe with the new MM!

But there’s an answer! R.I.P WN8, R.I.P WN6 and all rating calculations!

 

If in the near future no one is going to collect the correct values for WN8, it can be excluded from the XVM.

Let the others do your work… is a huge benefit for XVM… WAIT WHAAAAT? It can be excluded from XVM?

DO IT. Do it like the dumb Winchance calculation! Just remove it from the XVM. (but i’m sad because the Winchance was only deactivated on XVM website. I’m sooo sad it wasn’t fully removed from source code.)

 

Of course, we considered collecting expected values on our side. This could solve both the problem of correctness and a rare update of the table (and therefore sharp gap in the rating with every update), but with a detailed investigation of the WN8's developers method we found out out that collecting of values cannot be fully automated and requires manual control, which is inadmissible in our case.

Are you Kidding me? It’s 2017!!! Everything can be automated! You are running a database, so you can code fully automated calculations.

 

I'm used WN8 for a long time. Which rating should I look at now? In addition to WGR, EFF, WN6 also pay attention to the xTE rating.

I decided to use nothing and everything is fine for mw. Every rating is incorrect. No matter what rating is right. xTE is also outdated, guess why.

Are you Blind or can’t you see what WG is doing? They are destroying the STATSWHORE collecting websites!

 

But as well as before, we do not recommend a certain rating, but leave this choice for you.

I personally removed all stats from XVM.  Many, many reasons.

 

The current WN8 values in the XVM are also still correct for the absolute majority of players, but do not take into account the results on some new vehicles.

You got it! Just give them shit and they will accept it. No! They accepted it already! Just look in the forum. „All the crying why is my WN8 in game lower than on X Website“. Wait did you say it’s correct? How can it be correct with SPG changes?

 

We're also looking for a ratings which are not suffering from the disadvantages of WN8, and we can consider adding them to the mod.

Face it! WN8 and all other ratings are incorrect. And this WG official WGR is incorrect to. To many Battle types in WGR. But we must accept it.

So the WN8 died with SPG Update, but hey!

You have 3 choices:

1.Remove Ratings from XVM and burry this WN8 for ever (also remove all code which is showing Stats ingame in XVM)

2. Why don’t you make a new Formula (a modified wn8 calculation) and call it „XWN“, „WNX“ or WHATEVER is up to you, with fully automated Stats every 2 weeks or monthly?

3. Time for WN9! Sorry that’s just a joke… cause of SPG mechanics.

Too much work for you? I have a better idea for you. Burry this shit ingame Stats behind your House.

You are afraid that all the Statswhores will no more longer use XVM and donate money for your Work? And all Mod Pack Creators will cry cause of missing ingame stats?

Dude, sometimes you have to decide things, even if it’s bad for your business. But the worst decision was including Wn8 into XVM. It destroyed the gameplay of many many players.

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Are you Kidding me? It’s 2017!!! Everything can be automated! You are running a database, so you can code fully automated calculations.

 

Great! Waiting for your pull request.
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I am disappointed and surprised now. Just write a PHP Script to find the average values for each tank and open a new database for the new expected values. So you can press a coded BUTTON on this PHP site and let the Script do all the work. Sounds EZ? It's EZ :)

 

I was researching how they calculate the data for the average values... but i got distracted by one wn8 website and i stopped it. Maybe this doesn't had do anything with the calculation what i am writing right now. It had to do with played a tank and average damage. (ex: a database showed me avg. values of 1 tank.  1687dmg avg. at 364,75 games. 0.75 games? woot? there are 0.75 games too? i'm 100% sure there are only full matches i palyed over 40k games and there was never a 3/4 Battle) <- that fully destroyed me.

 

Question: After you saw the "automated" word... was there no thought if it's possible or not?

 

I'm done cause of this one website.

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Bang bang bang ©

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So this is the problem why i have the wn8 more smaller in game then the websites ?

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So this is the problem why i have the wn8 more smaller in game then the websites ?

 

Exactly.

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All or most of players accepting the new v30 values. It would be maybe a small solution to implement the current v30 table. The situation now isn't really good at all. U said wn8 is dying then remove that feature from xvm.

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4 минуты назад, N0strum сказал:

U said wn8 is dying then remove that feature from xvm.

 

and what rating will you use if wn8 wil be removed?

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i guess no one. this is better as a wrong rating without several new tanks and so on.

 

a good Point for now is the personal Rating or maybe the xte. But are not so good as a functional wn8 or wn9

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